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1Norma wrote:

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I was probably what you would call a Messianic, believing in Yeshua/Jesus

So you rejected Jesus Messiah? That is rejecting your salvation. Didn't anyone teach you about that?

YHWH is my Creator, Redeemer and Savior as He has promised. I am merely following the path He is leading me on as you must be faithful to the path by which He leads you.

Blessings

1Norma wrote:

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Hi Michael

Did I misunderstand what Zack is saying here;

I was probably what you would call a Messianic, believing in Yeshua/Jesus and also the wisdom and truth of Torah as life instruction. I have since fully returned to Judaism and completed conversion. That is why I do not post here very often anymore.

I thought he was saying he is no longer a Messianic (Christain) and had now fully converted to Judaism. How can a one fully return to Judaism (under the Law covenant) and still believe Jesus is Messiah and the new covenant?

If I missunderstood you, Zack, please let me know.

God Bless

Hi Norma,

Though we may word things slightly differently, I think your understanding is essentially correct. As far as Yeshua/Jesus is concerned, there is nothing there I feel need to accept or reject from my perspective. It is all about seeking to connect with the Father and placing all my trust in Him.

Blessings,
Zack

Brother Roger wrote:

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Zachary M wrote:

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1Norma wrote:

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Hi Michael

Did I misunderstand what Zack is saying here;

I was probably what you would call a Messianic, believing in Yeshua/Jesus and also the wisdom and truth of Torah as life instruction. I have since fully returned to Judaism and completed conversion. That is why I do not post here very often anymore.

I thought he was saying he is no longer a Messianic (Christain) and had now fully converted to Judaism. How can a one fully return to Judaism (under the Law covenant) and still believe Jesus is Messiah and the new covenant?

If I missunderstood you, Zack, please let me know.

God Bless

Hi Norma,

Though we may word things slightly differently, I think your understanding is essentially correct. As far as Yeshua/Jesus is concerned, there is nothing there I feel need to accept or reject from my perspective. It is all about seeking to connect with the Father and placing all my trust in Him.

Blessings,
Zack

Hi Zack,

Is the Judaism of today different that the Judaism of Jesus' day? If not, does it matter?

Hi Roger,

Obviously, I wasn't there, so my knowledge is largely limited to my own rationalizations. However, I would guess that no religion remains stagnant over that many years, not Judaism, Christianity or others. For Judaism, I would say that while major core principles remain, many traditions have been added over the years and fences put up in effort to preserve Jews from blending in and losing their uniqueness as a people. And sorry, I'm not sure precisely what you're asking in the last part of that question.

Blessings,
Zack

Brother Roger wrote:

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Zach -- I'm not sure precisely what you're asking in the last part of that question.

Roger -- I asked because I was listening to a lecture concerning God's promise to Israel and his future relationship with her in these end times. During the question/answer period someone in the audience asked whether the speaker could ever see himself converting to Judaism in order to participate in this promise etc. His answer was to say that he "didn't have a religious bone in his body", so no. However, he didn't think there was a modern version of "Judaism" that was close enough to the Judaism of Jesus day that we should think about joining up yet. He imagines that there will be someday, but not today. Anyway, I wanted to hear what you thought, seeing that you are living in that "neighborhood", so to speak.

I've also heard from other sources that Modern Judaism isn't anything like the Judaism of Jesus' day. But then, I have also heard that there are four? major, distinctive forms of Judaism today. Just going off the top of my head I'm thinking: Orthodox, (what else?) I can't remember. Anyway, from my limited perspective I can see, perhaps, the seminal beginnings of a renewed, reinvigorated, more informed view of a Jewish movement back to God. I don't know what to call it, messianic Judaism? I don't know.

Ah, I see. Honestly, I have my own problems with Judaism today, but a few issues guided my decision. First was that, as I studied, I seemed to find that I have much in common with the core of Judaism's teachings. Second, I have always had a draw towards Israel that I cannot explain. Even through the first 40 essentially non-religious years of my life, I felt a connection everytime I heard or saw things related to Israel. I felt a connection to the people that was beyond description and being Jewish is in large part being a part of a people and community moreso than being an individual. I now believe strongly that there is something to what rabbi's call "having a Jewish soul".

There are several variants of modern Judaism. Orthodoxy is the oldest and strictest. Also there is Conservative, Reform and Reconstructionist among the most common branches. Among the last 3 you can find some tremendous variance in practices from synagogue to synagogue. I hear some Reconstructionist Rabbi's and communities do not believe in God at all. I guess they may be secular Jews who just desire to gather socially?

As far as the Judaism of Jesus' day, I believe Judaism today is as much different from that - as the Judaism of Jesus' day is from the days of Moses or King David. I believe the main tenants of the faith are preserved for the most part by tradition, but much also has been added or altered. In large part, I believe changes implemented are meant to preserve the Jewish people as a distinct and holy* people. Changes had to also be implemented in the first century simply to exist under Roman rule as later changes were needed to exist in the diaspora.

* - Note the word translated "holy" in the Jewish culture simply means "separate". I mention this because many relate the word "holy" to being Godly or righteous in some manner.

Blessings,
Zack

Brother Roger wrote:

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In your post to Micheal, at times you appeared to be speaking for Judaism and the Jews as a people and at other times you appeared to be speaking for yourself. It was unclear whether you, personally, believe that Jesus is the messiah. You said that the three main objections Jews have to Jesus being a messiah were 1) A man can't be God, 2) Jesus did not fulfill the prophecies, 3) Jews don't believe in original sin. Would you like to open up a dialog about any of these here?

In case I did not answer that specifically, then the answer is no. I do not see Jesus or anyone else yet who has fulfilled the requirements to be Messiah. I am fine with discussing these subjects. My only reservation is that I don't want such discussions to cause contention. I already have quite a number of people from previous Messianic fellowship that no longer speak to me because of my conversion, which has saddened me greatly.

Blessings
Zack